The Soul Fall Down

Dr. John Mize: Did all the souls that were in the spiritual sky fall out of the spiritual sky at once or at different times, or are there any souls that are always good, they're not foolish, they don't fall down?

Prabhupāda: No, there are... Majority, 90%, they are always good. They never fall down.

Dr. John Mize: So we're among the 10%.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Or less than that. In the material, whole material world all the living entities they are... Just like in the prison house, there are some population, but they are not majority. The majority of the population, they are outside the prison house. Similarly, majority of living being, part and parcel of God, they are in the spiritual world. Only a few falls down.

Dr. John Mize: Does Kṛṣṇa know ahead of time that a soul is going to be foolish and fall?

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa? Yes, Kṛṣṇa may know because He is omniscient.

Dr. John Mize: Are more souls falling all the time?

Prabhupāda: Not all the time. But there is the tendency of fall down, not for all, but because there is independence... Everyone is not liking to misuse the independence. The same example: Just like a government constructing a city and constructs also prison house because the government knows that somebody will be criminal. So their shelter must be also constructed. It is very easy to understand. Not that cent percent population will be criminal, but government knows that some of them will be. Otherwise why they construct prison house also? One may say, "Where is the criminal? You are constructing..." Government knows, there will be criminal. So if the ordinary government can know, why God cannot know? Because there is tendency.

Dr. John Mize: The origin of that tendency is...?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. John Mize: From where does that tendency come?

Prabhupāda: Tendency means the independence. So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that you cannot become fall down, that is not independence. That is force. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says, yathecchasi tathā kuru [Bg. 18.63]. "Now you do whatever you like."

Jayatīrtha: Because Kṛṣṇa is independent, therefore the part and parcels...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Part and parcel must have a little portion of independence. Qualitatively, part and parcel means... Just like you take a drop of water from the sea. The, all the chemical composition is there in the drop. So Kṛṣṇa is fully independent. So we living entities we are drop. Still, the independence quality is there in minute quantity.

Dr. John Mize: But Kṛṣṇa has no tendency to fall, whereas we do.

Prabhupāda: No. Because Kṛṣṇa is God. Therefore He is all good. Even He falls down, to our estimation, it is not fall down. [break] ...cannot judge God. If we are devotee, in all circumstances we shall glorify God, "You are all-good." That is devotee. You cannot criticize God, "Oh, You are doing such thing," no.

Dr. John Mize: I'm still puzzled about the relationship of the soul to God. If the soul is eternal, as God is, and yet some souls have the tendency to fall and others don't have that tendency...

Prabhupāda: No, no, eternal does not mean not fall. Suppose you are now professor. So you can fall down from your position. But that does not mean you are not eternal. If you are fall down from your position, you do not lose your eternity. You simply fall down. You can become a professor; you can become an ordinary man. But you are eternal in all circumstance. Eternal... Fall down does not mean that he loses his eternal. That is stated that na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre [Bg. 2.20]. Find out. Ajo nityaḥ śāśvato 'yaṁ nahanyate hanyamāne śarīre [Bg. 2.20]. Na jāyate na mriyate vā kadācit. The living entity is never born or it never dies. This is eternity. You change your body, but you eternal.

Dr. John Mize: It's so puzzling, though, why I would spend eternity...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Therefore he requires that sattva-guṇa qualification.

Dr. John Mize: The what qualification?

Prabhupāda: That sattva-guṇa, goodness.

 

The puruṣa-avatāras are also in the category of bhagavat-tattva because each and every one of them is identical with the original form of the Personality of Godhead. The living entities are His infinitesimal particles and are qualitatively one with Him. They are sent into this material world for material enjoyment, to fulfill their desires to be independent individuals, but still they are subject to the supreme will of the Lord.  CC 2.10